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The Project L Tag Mechanics Look Familiar (and Fun)
- Опубліковано 5 гру 2022
- streamed Dec. 5, 2022
• /dev: Gameplay Ba...
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#FGC #Sajam #ProjectL
КОМЕНТАРІ • 256
Can’t wait to appreciate new players coming to fighting games for the first time, and will definitely not force my opponents to deal with toxic tag game vortex.
Don't worry, we'll play for about a week and then never touch it again.
@PsychoJosh I mean you might be right but you just didn't expose any argument in this thread. Mk11 has 1800 players for a year on steam and tekken 7 is at 5500 so I'm not sure about the former being more popular. Do you have any other indicator to check the popularity?
And I don't really understand your point of fighting games having not enough content, they are basically pvp esport games and if you take smth like LOL or valorant they don't have casual pve game but are still very popular.
Smash has a great community cause of its history and because the game is Nintendo branded, but I'm not sure it's casual content is very deep. Usually when I hear casual players on this game they either play it on their switch with their friends occasionally or play against bot if they like that. Nothing street fighter or tekken doesn't offer.
I think you're overestimating the content of the game and underestimating the history of the video game industry and the marketing around it. Ofc another serious criteria to consider is the accessibility.
FYI, smash isn't the most popular platformer in term of player base but it's brawhlalla, which is basically a f2p with easy controls and with a regular esport circuit.
Since riot has a huge fan base, will for sure support its esport and has already said that they removed every hard motion input, project L will mix accessibility (f2p and controls) and marketing (riot branded with characters coming from the most popular esport game) with the strongest net code possible due to the fact that they own a part of internet. I don't see how it couldn't bring a tons of new players to the genre
@Dakys I really don't know what you're talking about because my arguments have been supported by reason and logic for decades. Mortal Kombat and Smash have been consistently more popular than Tekken and Street Fighter. And the reason is because they have substantially more content that appeals to casuals. They appeal to people who would never even set foot in a local tournament. So putting esports/tourney scene at the forefront of these games is putting the carriage before the horse. People kept saying SF, DBFZ, etc. would grow the scene and that has not happened. They have not appealed to new players and even less retained new ones that got in because of them.
@PsychoJosh It isn't because the FGC isn't expanding a lot and getting popular at a fortnite level that there is no IN and OUT in term of new players. New players start fighting games everyday and of course this is a hard genre so the long term players coming everyday are just a tiny portion of these new players, but old players are stopping too so there is a turn over at some point.
Your take that the FGC is static isnt even supported by arguments or reasoning and not even clearly defined. If you're saying that the growth is slow or for some game non existant you're right of course (looking at tekken 7 steam charts the number of daily player hasn't grown in a year time) , but if you're saying that the community is purely static that's a whole other thing.
@PsychoJosh "The real reason is because these games don't offer any compelling content to people outside the FGC."
I can admit there's some truth to your original statement. I have a friend who got up the learning curve of FG's really fast and enjoys playing them, then proceeded to turn off RedBull Kumite PURELY because, "Holy shit they're gaming in an actual MMA ring this is the DORKIEST thing I've ever fucking seen," and "That trophy looks like it belongs on the prize table of a corporate bowling party," and "The scoreboard background between games looks like a fucking 70's airport lobby carpet."
But still, I believe the real words you're looking for are, "The real reason is because these games don't offer any money to the people who play them." The power of money is honestly the only thing that the FGC is missing now that playing online isn't absolute delay-based hell.
The entire concept of eSports is a giant marketing investment, and any successful eSports title you see the same business patterns that you see with successful ventures in other markets. There's a reason why every game awards we see less and less actual gameplay and more cinematic style trailers. Simply, the companies who make the fighting games either can't afford or haven't been willing to take that investment risk on marketing / live-servicing something that only has meaningful profit data from when online play was nonexistent.
Love that Sajam plays league and can speak on it fluently, it makes his coverage of project L that much better
@Sajam what seasons did you play outta curiosity?
@KarmaSpaz12 I did I was masters for the seasons I played and I still watch it
@que he actually did quite a few Legends of Runeterra streams and his gameplay and familiarity with lore was super solid. Very excited to see him be the bridge between communities when this game is finally done.
But fighting games are turnbased games so it would be more pertinent to ask if he plays the card game.
got whiplash when he said that the stage was from Ionia, didnt have any idea he actually knew about league after watching most of his project L videos
Sajam is the premium project L reactor. This man said Mystic Shot like everyone in the FGC knows Ezreal ability names.
I felt attacked cause I’m the player who wants to play Valorant in Project L with Azrael and Jinx 💨💨🔫
@Audrey Mystic Shot is a pretty significant card in Runeterra, might be the real reason he remembers.
Seriously, I've only listened the lore and names of Runeterra from tft and LoR. The constant rewrite of canon made it really difficult to keep up with.
I only know their abilities from tft.
Played at least a dozen ezreal games, definitely dont remember Ezreal's moves by name lol
Playing both in the FGC and League makes Sajam more relatable to watch than someone in the FGC reacting to League champs or League players reacting to a fighting game
I really like gank for the assist
I'm thinking peel for the burst
@Chris I'm in my smash bubble on this one. Thanks for the insight.
@ThisIsTheRun Wombo is used in League. It's from Smash originally, but it is deeply ingrained in LoL eSports casting as well.
@meethepie you mean to tell me 'wombo combo' has been a league term?
Rushdown is pushing
Zoning is freezing
Okizeme is sieging
Assist combos are wombo combos
Frame traps are baits
Supers are ultis
Auto combos are auto attacks
i unironically would love that
nothing scares me more than sajam using league lingo
I really like the visual clarity we're seeing here, not just with characters glowing when they do certain stuff (we see ahri glow when she does her dash cancel, we see another character do an alternate push block where they glow and get knocked way far away from their opponent, and we see darius get a different glow when he does an armored move, for example) but also some little things, like how OTG-able knockdowns have a different animation than normal knockdowns (we see several characters get hit by moves that end with them sitting on the ground instead of flat on their back, and they end up getting scooped up and comboed more). I've always found it really frustrating when I'm trying to learn a game and the game just doesn't give me the feedback to tell why things work or don't work in certain situations, and this seems like it would be easier to visually parse and understand.
Those 2 years of my life that I devoted to BBTag weren't wasted after all
I feel this,,, except I’m still gonna be ass lol
Riot really like to jab other companies
"do you guys don't have phones?" -> "So you do have phones"
"BBTAG auto run" -> "movement options include walking"
"You can't run tournaments" -> "Go check out your local tournaments"
@Lemon James he's right tho
@Lemon James TFT mobile version announcement
@D1zputed Pretty sure he's asking context for Riot's one
@ThisIsTheRun the diablo mobile game
Beyond happy to see a game in this universe that I want to play. I haven't had a game where most of the cast is new to me in quite a while.
Darius just looks sick and I love it. Love me a massive dude with a massive axe. Hope one of the spear users gets in as well, I want to see what J4's flag->stab combo might look like in a fighting game.
please please PLEASE let Jax be a counterhit character in Project L.
According to the potential leaks, maybe not. D: No J4 or Xin Zhao
I need Riot to get Sajam on the payroll, Sajam champ spotlights would be too hype
The trap interaction was nuts
it's one thing to have to watch out for the tag but the trap moving around like it's another assist lol
"Fighting games, like most things, are way better when enjoyed with friends" - message to the LoL community
Sajam: "LoL players can't be saved"
I vote Sajam for main commentator of Project L. He CLEARLY knows the community. (°u°)b
4:20 I’m not sure if anyone’s talked about this, but I’m pretty sure this was a guard break. It looks like Jinx blocked the attack but got put into a weird animation, so I think that’s another mechanic in the game.
She was blocking low and he was still in the air (albeit very very low) so I think it was just that she blocked wrong. Went frame by frame on it.
Remember more degen offense = more player expression
@OldAssYoungBoi The pacing in general.
I like the game as a gimmicky and unique rps but I'd rather play more hype stuff.
@Magma Spacer the movement of DNF is what keeps that game from being good.
Express this 4 way ambiguous mixup.
Tell that to F Hime players
Didn’t they say this about Dnf?
I'm so excited that they're finally making league of legends into a videogame
I am so incredibly hyped for this game. I've been playing such a wide variety of fighting games these recent years, and I've recently started to dedicate time to learning fighting games at a competitive level, and I'm just genuinely exited to try my hand at advancing my skill in a faster paced game like this.
Between those amd sf6 I'm about to make that jump to serious play as well.
The combination of gameplay types from MvCI and Power Rangers makes it insanely hyped for me.
I really hope this game is so good it makes me love the tag fighter genre. I've just never been able to get behind blocking for 30 seconds at a time if you catch the wrong mix and this game looks like it's gonna have some menacing offense. The movement looks freaking shweet so i'll probably spend a lot of time trying to master that.
Aesthetically I really hate heavily delayed OTGs - can't get past the way it looks like the character is just hanging out waiting to get hit some more. But the rest looks sick
Seeing project L about a year ago is what got me into playing Xrd and then Strive. I've played and enjoyed over 10 different fighting games since (sticking to strive and melty blood though) and even if Project L never comes out, I'm still glad I gave this genre a try and I'm definitely here to stay. Excited for SF6, Tekken 8 and PL.
league lingo has made me realize that we in the fgc probably sound insane talking about our games as well
Can't wait to see what the full roster will be. I think kha'zix is would be sick.
I love the look and art style of this game. I personally don’t enjoy playing tag fighters but I’m hyped to see high level tournament play for this game.
“You know someone will play 2 shooting characters”
Can’t wait to play jinx teemo and make people wanna uninstall day one!
Dude , Jhin and Caitlyn if you want zoners who can still hit you full screen while setting traps EVERYWHERE.
putting the projectiles in project L
I watched the trap part thinking "that's a lot of work for goldlewis drone". I think that's enough strive for this week.
You know every character with a kiss as a cmd grab is gonna followup with the nastiest combo known to man
That mini discussion about calling the tag in ur own self gank was hilarious 😂
Movement looks pretty fast but once a hit goes into a combo the game looks like it enters slow mode for the entire combo.
Ahri fireball should be fine, look how she loses the three orbs when she uses them, so I guess she regenerates them over time and the more orbs when used the further and more hitstun the projectile has. But ye she looks mad fun. Projectile to make setups, unique overhead, aridashes for the left/rights? Count me in!
Ekko's wall bounce has the best "BONK!" feel.
For Sajam's sake I hope some ninjas are present on release
what makes me excised is that if the game looks like this now, I can't wait to see what it looks like whenit's polished
Haven't ever really been into tag fighters but I'm sure gonna try with this.
Notably, they showed off airdashes only during the "unique movement options" section, and didn't mention them in the list - I'm not positive this game is going to have a universal (or near-universal) airdash.
im glad everyone is as hype with the jinx/ekko flame chomper combo as i was when i watched that dev-diary video
I have always been a shooter FPS kind of person but after buying Strive and not playing it. I think Project L will finally be it for me. If the inputs are more linear and simple I could see myself getting into it. I hate league but love the lore
Never thought id say this but *god* i hope theres skins beyond just color swaps. I NEED dunkmaster darius in this game
@Eric Joseph I wouldn't be surprised if they're more expensive actually since fighting game models will be harder to make skins for cuz of how big they are.
@Rukir no skins for agents makes sense tbh. They still havethe most insane gun skins of any shooter ever. There's nothing else they'll be able to skin in a fighting game so it will have to be the champs. Might even get some project l exclusive skins based on what they've done with wild rift and LOR.
@ivan134 maybe. they dont do agent skins for valorant, oddly, so.. who knows
@Shīra i imagine they'll be priced similarly to league of legends
It's a f2p game, they will for sure put a lot of resources into making cosmetics.
I'm pretty hyped to play this game in 2024 or 2025.
It's still super early and all, but I hope they'll put in facial animation and change up the sound effects. Some things don't have fitting sound effects like Darius's axe, and the unchanging faces are kinda uncanny. Placeholder resources are a thing, but yeah.
I wonder what other characters they’re planning on adding, albeit weird I wanna see Reksai added in I feel like she’d be a very interesting character
I haven't played League since maybe 2010-ish, but I will be all over this if I can play as best boi Kog'Maw. I know it's not likely, but we'll see who all makes the cut over time.
It's bbtag, but without hard combo limitations and no cross combo.
I don’t want project L to ride the hype of arcane by adding every main character from the show, but you have echo, you have jinx, at least let me rush down with VI, that’s the one character I’m gunna main if she’s intoduced
Sitting here wondering if Riot is gonna call Sajam back after he ate their food that one time
My roster expectations for this game are any champion that is in arcane season one or 2 meaning Camilla, vi, and wolf. And any character that has been in a major musical cinematic. The last spots will be choices to round out the roster.
I’m actually hyped for this game!
Ahri and Ekko look fun as fuck.... THAT BEING SAID I can't wait to see Katarina. I can't play her in league but I wanna go ham with her here
@Jan S.G Pyke is like my favorite hook support. I'm down to play some Pyke for sure. I can see his dash being a hit that crumbles the enemy on hit.
I'm looking forward to seeing if Thresh or Pyke can come into the roster, love me the hook ability champs. Especially Thresh, the potential that can be done with his lantern ability and the tag team mechanic.
I love that it’s 2v2 but Sajam wouldn’t you agree they should push the limit and make it full on 3v3? That means more combo and mixup/pressure potential. Also different unique team synergies. Dbfz and Marvel would have some competition
Late to reply but 2v2 is probably a healthy balance between easier to pick like a 1v1 and the balls to the wall complexity in a full 3v3. Also with fewer characters on a team it lets each individual character be potentially more complex on other own. As trying to pick up a team makes the learning process that much harder in tag games compared to a normal 1v1. I’ll be honest in that personally at least I don’t play dbfz as much since I can’t decide on who to play in the anchor spot. Mix between over choice and the characters just not appealing to me.
I don’t know if seeing league characters wavedash will ever not be funny
4:16 I'm surprised Sajam didnt notice the rebeat here
they should give ahri magneto grab. she needs it
Do you think they'll give Jinx Air Hyper Viper Beam?
About the question if you can run this on locals
theres tons of online events for TFT/League/Valo so local events for project L should be alright
Idk about Majors that arent hosted by Riot tho, unless they go the capcom route
but I reaallly doubt theyll just be like "nah you cant run project L at CEO"
I can already tell Yasuo and Ahri are going to be a disgusting air combo/air juggle team.
I have no doubt this game has the potential to bring fighting games back to the mainstream, my only source for this is project l looks so good I decided to get into fighting games, I'm now a month into guilty gear and honestly some of the most fun, satisfying, salty and great times I've had playing games since i was young, not to mention the fgc is actually a great community, some people think otherwise but as someone who comes from the fps community yall seem like angels.
watching the project L videos makes me wish ctag was popular
Illaoi looks so freaking cool
15:30 For me, it was usually more everyone blaming me in top lane despite the fact I was the only person with a positive KDA, and we were already 3 dragons down.
Dang, you even got someone on the Enemy team backing you up? I didnt even see that when I last played league a few years back. EVERY SINGLE GAME just had one person in the post-game going "Top diff" regardless of how much they actually contributed. It was actually more fun to call out a teammate for doing that when they were always pinging for help rather than play the game itself
Riot allows tournaments for league that aren't licensed by them so I have faith for the fgc tournaments being both grassroots and official
Cant wait to see Sykunno vs Justin Wong on day 1 for his first game 😂
I don’t really like team games, but that’s the beauty of free to play. I’ll give it a shot anyway.
Praying to L jesus for a Zed reveal before full release or at least in the year following🙏
Imagine if Zed is revealed
And he plays almost like Strider Hiryu
I can’t wait to release content on this game
Bro it is so much like BBTag... I fucking love BBTag
remember when we were scared this game would be too "simplified" lol
This game looks so good but the stage size is so big that if they have any kind of zoning characters in the game who are competent we could be looking at some serious degeneracy in the meta
the movement options makes that kind of zoning fine.
3:18 that's Millia air backdash right there
Even though some of the fight effects look painted on cause obviously this is in development... I kind of like it?
Game looks great. I know League players love to bitch about Riot's gameplay and balance teams but IMO that's mostly just salt, and Riot puts a tremendous amount of effort into making a polished, smooth product and great character designs. The potential here is super exciting, although I'm bad enough at Strive I worry I'll struggle with a tag game.
I am a little nervous about how they might handle tournaments and balance, as a outsider looking into league and valorant it seems so corporately competitive in a way that it seems sterile of any real fun where the only thing that matters is who won and did your rank change. Their games obviously have at least some 'fun' or else they wouldn't have so many players, but the general vibe I get whenever anyone talks about them is more like an abusive relationship than a fun game to play. Obviously this does not automatically apply to project L, a entirely different game, and I know its not a very compelling argument, but I essentially I get "bad/weird vibes" form Riot's games and events where they may be captivating, but not actually fun. This could very possibly just be me though
Let's not forget that fighting game players talk about rank and their games like that too. As far as the corporate stuff goes, I think the FGC often overlooks how deep corporate/capitalist influence in this community goes and has always gone.
I think it will feel a lot less corporate just because the game by its nature is more focused on players than teams
Gonna be honest you said a lot...but said nothing. You just said you had a feeling that some things are off when someone else talks to you about how riot runs their tournaments? That barely makes sense. It would be fine if you simply said that you did not like that they were so hands on with their eSports. In which case, that makes sense and is totally understandable.
They talk at the end of the video about talking with fgc event planners/ coordinators or something so it's likely they will try to make it as comfortable as possible for fgc since it's a huge demographic that isn't getting enough love.
I am familiar with fighting games somewhat but not knowledgeable so I can only say so much
'That's not Yun...that's Jaime.' High quality joke not getting enough love in the comments.
wait has project l been confirmed a 4 button fighter?
In BFTG active switch is crazy good
6:42 Imagine if Mrs. Fortune in Skullgirls worked like this lmao
Tbh it looks like a really fun game but I see all the things that ultimately make fighting games fail in gaining new influx of players outside the core community or people newly getting into it. The biggest being the confusion that more options/mechanics directly means more player expressions. I see a lot of movement options but (at least from this vid) I don't see how that enables different people to play the same character in a different way and still be viable. Just the same combos from a culmination of other games
90% are gonna play Ahri 24/7.
Imma try and get in on that early meta.
Ekko and Illaoi are my team. Idgaf who else is in the game or what tier they are.
MVCI CAME OUT BEFORE CROSS TAG DAMN IT
But the mechanics here are far more Cross Tag than MvCI. MvCI doesn't have assists, it just has the ability to tag in any time - even while getting hit, but at the cost of meter then.
BBTag has assists, multiple assists per character that you get to use all of (rather than picking one of as in most other team fighters), lets you switch characters very quickly any time while the assist is on screen, and has a burst that brings in your second character to perform it. Project L took all of those mechanics, not MvCI's.
Riot should hire Sajam tbh.
5:46 literally explained the Ark gameplay in the middle of a Project L video lmao
I hope the tag mechanic is called Ganking
If that leak are false (they put teemo, of course its false) who you think will be on the game?
I’m officially a Riot games fan
The SWT parallel is definitely intentional. Riot made fun of blizzard during the ten year anniversary reveals, made fun of capcom during last years presentation and now this? Not a coincidence.
I probably missed it in the video. What was the SWT parallel that Riot made?
Think i'll start messing around in bbtag again till its out.
Raw tagging called "lane swapping"
sajam complaining about bad league teammates is weirdly cathartic
BBTAG gang rise up! 💪
I'm definitely not going to learn day one infinites, that would be so toxic for new FG players....😈
Ness pfp checks out
My most anticipated thing about Project L is the salty messages I'm bound to get from toxic gamers
I'm kinda scared of this game. It looks very hard. There is a reason I don't play Marvel.
Looks like a game where playing even slightly defensively is masochistic. Somehow, we're still paying for the sins of O. Sagat 30 years later.
There better be bans in the game
As a big fan of BBTag, I'm quite happy with what we've seen of the gameplay for this so far. And I quite agree with you with wanting to play Ahri, at least of those they've showed so far.
But I'm still skeptical as hell of the F2P aspect. I've yet to see a F2P game where the F2P elements didn't end up making me feel like it wasn't worth playing for whatever good was underneath them - not even Multiversus. Also I fear they'd patch things too frequently in a F2P fighting game, not giving things time to develop. I truly don't know if my love of team fighting games can overcome my hate of F2P games.
Coming from a league player, if they handle it the same way then you'd probably just get all the characters after a week or so of casual play, assuming that the roster is not that big on release of course, they usually focus all their monetization on overpriced cosmetics.
@Spammer Man Expansions every other month sounds insane to me, as someone who spent a long time playing Hearthstone, and wound up leaving it in part (although there were many other reasons) because expansions grew more frequent. Granted, the ones they added were smaller ones in between the three yearly main expansions, which they call mini-expansions, but still.
At the end of the day, I don't think it matters to me how much you can get in what period of time. It matters to me that the games are grindy and trying to make you feel like you have to play a certain amount every day to keep up. Daily tasks in and of themselves have become a red flag for me, and I've yet to see a F2P game without those. I want to be playing the game solely because I enjoy it, for as much or as little time as I feel like; I've come to hate game mechanics that are designed to try to get me to do otherwise. They actively make me enjoy my time with the game less. And I wind up asking myself: why should I play a game with features that dampen my enjoyment like that when others that lack those feature are out there?
I don't know how Riot handles other games but Legends of Runeterra is really good, it doesn't even feel like a f2p game a lot of times. You can build an entire deck every 2 to 3 weeks. They only do expansions every other month which is around the same frequency as other card games, and don't do emergency updates unless certain decks show too much play/win rate.
So I'm not worried too much for Project L's f2p status.
I thought the rant was part of the outro. No, it was a several minute prelude to the outro.
I'm predicting it will get faster
I wonder who else will come from Ionia. They're all generically suitable for a fighting game lol.
The thumbnail is exactly what I was thinking